Eddie Dunn ⋅ Highland Lakes, NJ U.S. Army, Master Sergeant ⋅ 20 years served

Paul and DeMonfort, et al...so appreciate the contributions and thought leadership here. What I think you are all speaking to falls into three fundamental categories of transformation:

1. Vocational fitness that aligns purpose and passion
2. Emotional fitness that drives the right behavior in a new civilian context
3. Cultural fitness in understanding and navigating the norms of a new civilian culture

I think we have to go "back to the future" and painfully admit, fundamentally, that veterans are NOT fully prepared for employment on day one despite all that we've invested to this point. With even more brutal honesty, we've pushed out several million post 9-11 veterans with one TAP class and over 45K VSO's to trying, with the best of intentions, to fill the gap. Although veteran unemployment is now at an all time low, the data is beginning to show from a retention perspective, there is glitch in the matrix, a disturbance in the force that requires deeper reflection and contemplation of a better solution. Fundamentally, pushing against the status quo I ask:

Why are we not, with the same veracity and intention, reinvesting millions, if not billions to transform this talent pool into the civilian superheroes they were meant to be?

Said another way, why is it acceptable to transition a veteran out with just a TAP class when we spend billions to build the greatest fighting force the world has ever seen?

In all transparency, I've been contemplating making a run at creating the first ever civilian reboot camp transformation process that addresses this PRE-EMPLOYMENT CONDITION OF "RE-ENTRY" by building a baseline foundation that accelerates our new civilian identity and new civilian destiny.

In other words, is it possible to move strategically to the left of the current transition process and create a veteran talent pool that is civilian ready on day one with the above in mind? This does a complete 180 from the norm, but have to wonder, why no-one has done it yet.. Instead of employers being Military friendly, what would happen if we unleashed 200K plus a year veterans that were Civilian Ready? Think about that for a second...the implications are enormous!

Watch...someone real smart is going to figure this out... ;)

Eddie Dunn ⋅ Highland Lakes, NJ U.S. Army, Master Sergeant ⋅ 20 years served

Hank...very familiar with Jung and Myers typology, personality profiles and other similar assessments...all of them are good and so appreciate your insights and wisdom here. Of particular note, what sets veterans apart is that very fabric of our DNA brings out our purpose and passion. Unfortunately, I do not see a systemic, programmatic framework that brings that purpose and passion into convergence with their true civilian vocation. I've seen it over and over again in that "I can do anything" invincibility that veterans often lead with which doesn't play well in the civilian sandbox.

Paul Trejo ⋅ Austin, TX University of Texas at Austin ⋅ 40 years experience

Thank you, Master Sergeant Dunn for your 20 years of service. Twenty years is such a long time, that looking at the civilian world anew is going to be a challenge. My dad, uncles and cousins were in the Military, so I did see some of this growing up.

The US Military is so structured and rank oriented, while the USA is apparently unstructured and anti-rank oriented, so this is a possible confusion. Of course there's structure to USA business -- but it is hidden after the 1960's.

Increasingly in business, you never address your boss as, "sir" or "ma'am". You don't even call them by their last names. We use their first names, but we NEVER treat them as equals. That's the trick.

We maintain strict rank -- the boss is the boss, and the managers eat lunch separately (most of the time). However -- we never make any open display of that.

The chain of command remains in place. You never go over the bosses' heads. You follow the chain of command, and any appeals structure firmly in place. Civilians take this for granted, so they may forget to tell a newly exited veteran about it. Yet it's urgent.

This will be true for large and small companies -- but especially the large USA companies.

Best wishes,
Paul Trejo, MA

DeMonfort Carter ⋅ San Francisco, CA UPS ⋅ 25 years experience

Eddie, that is an excellent question. It's also one that does not get asked often. This also lends to your experience and wisdom. First, know that your experience makes you adaptable to practically any and all situations. But the rest of the world isn't. When you encounter a problem you search for a solution (adapt and overcome). Be ready because the rest of the world will not respond as such. It will be frustrating at times because you have been trained to recognize the obstacle but find a way to succeed anyway. Your new environment may want to talk (or complain) first. But know that once you find the rhythm of the organization, you will be looked at as a leader and a calm presence to help guide others through problems.

No matter what industry you are in, you are always in the people business. When you can lead people in the military, every other industry is easy. But you will also have to get used to the pace of the outside world and the ease of use in electronics.

I hope this helps.

Henry ("Dr. Hank") Stevens ⋅ Fort Lauderdale, FL Human Resources Quality Assurance, LLC (Now Retired) ⋅ 50 years experience

Hello Eddie!

When I served, the Army Security Agency (ASA) tested me and thought I had a bent for separating the human wheat from the chaff. They assigned me to their Personnel Procurement and Processing detachment. There, I identified those I thought would best fit the ASA profile. And, they were right. I spent the next 50 years helping my employer(s) pick the best fit for the available opportunities.

In its simplest of terms, most people fall into the trap of trying to do a better job of what they did before. That is, they think playing to their EXPERIENCE is where it is at. It's not. Playing to your TALENT is the gold standard.

But, how to really identify YOUR talents is the challenge.

It might sound kinda basic but, DISCOVER YOUR TALENTS AND WORK IN A JOB THAT TAPS THOSE ASSETS is the theme of your quest.

Here is a link to a website (free) that will help you get started. It has a pretty good results analyzer BUT, if you want my personal two cents about the results, contact me off-channel with the letter and number grades (also free!) hlstevens42@gmail.com

Good luck!

http://www.humanmetrics.com/personality

Hank

Eddie Dunn ⋅ Highland Lakes, NJ U.S. Army, Master Sergeant ⋅ 20 years served

Morgan...great advice and appreciate you taking the time to respond here. I'm primarily focused on the change itself. What about the pre-employment condition on re-entry when it comes to cultural assimilation, emotional intelligence and vocational alignment? It seems to me that no one focuses in on this BEFORE transitioning military begin their journey. I'm genuinely interested if there is anything out there that addresses this systemically or programmatically that will build a baseline of knowledge so they are civilian ready on day one.

Thoughts?

Morgan Hoogvelt ⋅ Helotes, TX Morgan Human Capital Management ⋅ 12 years experience

Hi Master Sgt, first thanks for your service and here are a few tips that I would recommend for you:

1. Be prepared to start at the bottom - you are not entitled to anything or owed anything. Lots of vets get out thinking they are.

2. You do NOT have to spend the next 20 years in your next job or position. If it works out great, if not, don't worry about it.

3. Start thinking about what you want to do and are good at and that you will also enjoy getting up each morning and going to do. Nothing worse than taking a job to take a job and hating it.

4. Remember and start with the basics. You have heard the phrase 'have to crawl before you can walk' - start with practicing your interview skills, networking, etc. and move towards mastering the art of interviewing, etc.

5. Remember than no one will help you more than you help yourself. Be prepared to ratchet up your comfort level and get out of your comfort zone. You will have to talk with people, network, ask for jobs, etc.

The USO program is wonderful and great; I have spoken at the USO program here in San Antonio and met some really great students and people. However, if you want to go a step further and if you feel you need a coach, go and get one. There is a difference between having a cheerleader vs a coach in your corner.

Good luck and feel free to connect if you need further advice!

Morgan

Eddie Dunn ⋅ Highland Lakes, NJ U.S. Army, Master Sergeant ⋅ 20 years served

Rob...spot on!

Powerful revelation you just shared and I see that we have a few things in common in being Army Brats as well. Re-entry and getting past the culture shock to a place of prosperity in this transformation is an integral part of a veteran and his/her families success in the long term.

Appreciate the link...I will marinate in this for sure!

Eddie

Eddie Dunn ⋅ Highland Lakes, NJ U.S. Army, Master Sergeant ⋅ 20 years served

Hi Shane...thank you for the thoughtful answer here. USO's Pathfinder program looks good and no question, Mike is rock star! Predominantly, both them, and many others, are focused on the technical capabilities of getting a job as the ultimate end goal.. I don't question the veracity of who they are and quality of how it gets done...all good and just as it should be.

However, I'm specifically asking about a very focused transformation process that gets at the heart of the change each veteran will experience as they transition out of the military?

For example:

1. Does there exist any content or curriculum that focuses on how a we begin to adapt and adopt our military values to civilian ones? Many veterans unconsciously project there military values upon a civilian population with mixed results. "What if" we addressed this BEFORE we transition out...would it alleviate our frustration that naturally builds when civilian bosses fail to live up to our standards? Would this influence our decision making ahead of time if we learned to manage our own expectations, better?

There are several other root causes and examples I could point out...but I have yet to find a programmatic approach and process that gets to the heart of the matter...it's almost as if we need to go to the left and create a pre-employment, civilian reboot camp transformation process, taking the very best of our military experience and helping us build a new civilian identity and new civilian destiny as the long term employment and retention solution.

Just my two cents...for what it's worth.

Eddie